Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Hmmm stewards penalise Perez five grid spots for changing line on Massa...thoughts?
F1 in 2014.
- Thread starter David Morton
- Start date
Jeff Young
GT40s Supporter
Awesome race. Happy for Ricciardo. Great drive by Nico.
If you watch the vid from above, Perez clearly moved left and off the line Vettel was on after he saw Massa coming. Perez's fault in my view. Stewards got htat right, but should have penalized Rosberg on the chicane blow by.
If you watch the vid from above, Perez clearly moved left and off the line Vettel was on after he saw Massa coming. Perez's fault in my view. Stewards got htat right, but should have penalized Rosberg on the chicane blow by.
Agreed on all, Nico must have been really stressed out trying to milk that wounded car home. Perez messed up when trying to block the pass way too late, of course at those speeds it was like, a millisecond late. Lucky no one was hurt.
Can't see that Jeff - Hamilton had no overlap and hadn't even attempted an overtake - it seemed to me he was following through. To say Hamilton 'might' have made an overtake in that position and therefore Rosberg gained an advantage by overshooting is a big ask. The 'hand back' rule is clearly there for preventing an overtaking manoevre 'in progress' by short cutting i.e. leaving the circuit.
Pat
Supporter
Keith, I agree with Jeff on both counts. Perez had complained on the radio of rear brake failure and clearly stepped out on Massa who then clouted him. The media reports here indicate Massa actually initiated braking 5 meters or so prior to his normal braking point.
As for Rosberg, it was clearly a superior drive with an ailing car. However, his off road excursion did provide a 4-tenths advantage over Hamilton which took him out of DRS range.
As for Rosberg, it was clearly a superior drive with an ailing car. However, his off road excursion did provide a 4-tenths advantage over Hamilton which took him out of DRS range.
I agree Pat but the Rule covers actual overtaking manoeuvres not future events. The reason you state is very valid regarding DRS however, it was not into a DRS zone, and 3/4 of a lap from the detection zone so arguable. DRS activation finishes before the chicane. But I should imagine a future 'tweak' could easily cover that if they thought it necessary as in those circumstances, that would most certainly be an 'advantage gained' into a DRS detection zone.
The Stewards picked up on the Perez thing very quickly ( I first thought that Massa had flunked it) but with different cameras you can see Perez clearly moved the braking zone which us a no no..
But, well done 'Smiler!' What a run!
Good race I thought - the Canucks really love their racing....:thumbsup:,
The Stewards picked up on the Perez thing very quickly ( I first thought that Massa had flunked it) but with different cameras you can see Perez clearly moved the braking zone which us a no no..
But, well done 'Smiler!' What a run!
Good race I thought - the Canucks really love their racing....:thumbsup:,
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Pat, agreed it gave Rosburg an advantage, but would have been a very tough call and create a precedent to penalise everyone who out brakes themselves at a chicane.
No doubt Perez moved slightly but under the rules I thought a driver could move once and once only to block. Maybe someone with greater knowledge then me can clarify?
No doubt Perez moved slightly but under the rules I thought a driver could move once and once only to block. Maybe someone with greater knowledge then me can clarify?
What about opɹɐɔᴉɹ then 
That lad drives with Schumacheresque approach , drive the wheels off the car even if its slower and be prepared to pounce at the first opportunity. Brilliant.
Bob
That lad drives with Schumacheresque approach , drive the wheels off the car even if its slower and be prepared to pounce at the first opportunity. Brilliant.Bob
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Doc my initial interpretation, was that Perez braked a lot earlier than Massa expected and Massa simply didn't react quickly enough. However there is no doubt after replaying the incident several times that Perez did move slightly off line.
All of which could have been caused by the fact his rear brakes were shot. I think Perez will have a good argument if he appeals.
All of which could have been caused by the fact his rear brakes were shot. I think Perez will have a good argument if he appeals.
For the stewards, I believe the deciding factor to be the simple facts that Perez jinked left in the braking zone for a right hand turn(!) and Massa was correctly turning to the right to take the right hand turn. It was Perez slight but bizarre move which swayed the judges I think. If you were a cynic, and given previous experience of Perez driving skills, you might say that he performed the little flick with the deliberate intention of throwing Massa off..line/apex/track.
But, like most others, I saw it differently at first from a typical spectator viewing angle. It's only the overhead that explains it.
But, like most others, I saw it differently at first from a typical spectator viewing angle. It's only the overhead that explains it.
I realise there is no Paddock dispute on Mass/Perez but anyway, here is the definitive overhead shot which tells the true story...frame by frame
http://i.imgur.com/WRTu05L.jpg
And... in real time:
http://gfycat.com/RegularIllinformedHyracotherium
Although it appears that Massa moves right, in fact he straightens his approach (coming from right hand bend) as seen in the frame by frame graphic above, in order to reach the turn in the correct place.. This would have been an easy overtake for Massa..
http://i.imgur.com/WRTu05L.jpg
And... in real time:
http://gfycat.com/RegularIllinformedHyracotherium
Although it appears that Massa moves right, in fact he straightens his approach (coming from right hand bend) as seen in the frame by frame graphic above, in order to reach the turn in the correct place.. This would have been an easy overtake for Massa..
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Great overhead shots. Wow, Perez actually had time to react and try to block Massa's pass attempt. I was trying to give Perez a break of sorts by thinking he just relaxed his line through the right hander but NO, he actually jinked left in response to Massa! Bad, bad move son. Massa was coming way too fast for that to work.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
I thought that under the rules a driver could block as long as it was once and he did not move back onto the racing line. Here is the latest I could find.http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&r...CsnWq52klCdCt1Fkw&sig2=dEgkCEjMytVvKf_HSDYHmg
If this is still the case Perez should not have been penalised.
If this is still the case Perez should not have been penalised.
Terry Oxandale
Skinny Man
I feel it could be argued that he also was setting up for the left-hander coming up fast.
Pete McCluskey.
Lifetime Supporter
Thanks Keith, I wasn't aware of that, but I also As Terry says,think he has an argument that he was setting up for the corner coming up.
True, but what the stewards would have looked at was Perez 'normal' line into the corner (as each driver obviously has a slightly different approach) and his telemetry, both of which seemed to indicate that Perez made a deliberate and illegal move at that point.
It is the telemetry which is the most telling and unfortunately we don't have access to that, but there again, if we did, we'd have nothing to talk about!
It is the telemetry which is the most telling and unfortunately we don't have access to that, but there again, if we did, we'd have nothing to talk about!
